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STRELKA |
The combine system is great, it definitely works well and is a huge cash sink that allows success at a great cost of items and money.
- PROBLEM: However, I think this should be extended to include intense items. Maybe this isn't such an issue in hsoma because the variance in weapons and armour values are so much smaller than devil weapons (which can easily have difference of 10 in both min and max values) - but it's a real problem. You can use something like 40 hardened/ 20 rare/10 epic weapons to make 1 intense and the roll can be such garbage that it is unusable, even worse than the epics you just used to combine it. It's deeply frustrating to drop 500k on combines, get through months of gathering/trading of high value weaponry...to get a garbage item. That weapon then gets dropped on the floor or stored away on a store forever. - SUGGESTION: How about you can combine 2 intense weapons for a re-roll on the production of 1 intense. Remember, this weapon can also roll terrible stats (and for some people, non-perfect is automatically terrible) for a great cost. Hell, if that's considered OP - make it 3 intense combines for 1 reroll, or give 2-intense-to-1-reroll a 50% success chance, or make intense combine cost 500k per go. Extending this system to allow people to pay a very high price to recover from trash combines would improve the player experience a lot, and extend the cash-sink, high-cost mentality of combine. It would stay authentic to the soma ethos of 'hard grinding for rewards'.
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[quote="STRELKA"]The combine system is great, it definitely works well and is a huge cash sink that allows success at a great cost of items and money.
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PROBLEM:
However, I think this should be extended to include intense items. Maybe this isn't such an issue in hsoma because the variance in weapons and armour values are so much smaller than devil weapons (which can easily have difference of 10 in both min and max values) - but it's a real problem.
You can use something like 40 hardened/ 20 rare/10 epic weapons to make 1 intense and the roll can be such garbage that it is unusable, even worse than the epics you just used to combine it. It's deeply frustrating to drop 500k on combines, get through months of gathering/trading of high value weaponry...to get a garbage item. That weapon then gets dropped on the floor or stored away on a store forever.
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SUGGESTION:
How about you can combine 2 intense weapons for a re-roll on the production of 1 intense. Remember, this weapon can also roll terrible stats (and for some people, non-perfect is automatically terrible) for a great cost.
Hell, if that's considered OP - make it 3 intense combines for 1 reroll, or give 2-intense-to-1-reroll a 50% success chance, or make intense combine cost 500k per go.
Extending this system to allow people to pay a very high price to recover from trash combines would improve the player experience a lot, and extend the cash-sink, high-cost mentality of combine. It would stay authentic to the soma ethos of 'hard grinding for rewards'.
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#1 2017/11/04 19:03:40 |
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ISELIX |
Yep!
I dont think people really realise how hard it is to get a decent weapon off combine, at intense level the hard/hard rare/rare epic/epic slog only to roll a bad intense! Much worse for dsoma, their varience is much greater i think x2 intense req. @500k/pop to get 1 intense back re-rolled would be awesome whats the point in having a feature that generates junk lol? very frustrating however, this would greatly increase the prices of weapons, as every1 would be in a situation where they KNEW 100% they'd end up with an amazing intense, with a little bit of time/patience, then only absolute maximum weps worth anythng so i doubt anything will change, unless the intense/intense roll is very reestricitive, maybe 3 req and 1 mill a pop?
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[quote="ISELIX"]Yep!
I dont think people really realise how hard it is to get a decent weapon off combine, at intense level
the hard/hard rare/rare epic/epic slog only to roll a bad intense! Much worse for dsoma, their varience is much greater
i think x2 intense req. @500k/pop to get 1 intense back re-rolled would be awesome
whats the point in having a feature that generates junk lol? very frustrating
however, this would greatly increase the prices of weapons, as every1 would be in a situation where they KNEW 100% they'd end up with an amazing intense, with a little bit of time/patience, then only absolute maximum weps worth anythng
so i doubt anything will change, unless the intense/intense roll is very reestricitive, maybe 3 req and 1 mill a pop?[/quote]
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#2 2017/11/04 20:28:57 |
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STRELKA |
"ISELIX" Hmm I do see what you mean, but I don't think it would change so much. For example, people only trade at epic tag at the moment because they are afraid of getting a bad roll (or many failed combines) making their trade goods useless. Are you really going to burn 10 epic weapons of a type you don't use to get an intense, maybe roll well (maybe not), then re-roll the intense with another bad one - just to get a good weapon to sell? Or are you just going to trade at epic for the type you want and go about it yourself? Second option for me. I don't think this change would make much difference to how people approach trading or combining, it would only give them another avenue to risk money/time/luck to get a good item. For example, I have a nice intense +5 bow but it's not maximum possible attack, therefore I still horde and trade for every bow I get to combine for the perfect wep. If I get a bad roll it only delays the process, I will still combine all bows and get every one I can. Allowing me to re-roll bad intense doesn't change this process at all, it only makes it more fair (and shorter) for the work I have put in. I don't think it would completely de-value weaker stat weapons, people who are seeking perfection will only chase perfect sat weps, but many people just want something that is very good (or just good) to get some nice speed or attack on as their hunting/farming/initial pvp weapon. If anything is lowers the value of perfect weapons because they are achievable by more people.
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[quote="STRELKA"][quote="ISELIX"]
however, this would greatly increase the prices of weapons, as every1 would be in a situation where they KNEW 100% they'd end up with an amazing intense, with a little bit of time/patience, then only absolute maximum weps worth anythng
[/quote]
Hmm I do see what you mean, but I don't think it would change so much. For example, people only trade at epic tag at the moment because they are afraid of getting a bad roll (or many failed combines) making their trade goods useless.
Are you really going to burn 10 epic weapons of a type you don't use to get an intense, maybe roll well (maybe not), then re-roll the intense with another bad one - just to get a good weapon to sell? Or are you just going to trade at epic for the type you want and go about it yourself? Second option for me.
I don't think this change would make much difference to how people approach trading or combining, it would only give them another avenue to risk money/time/luck to get a good item. For example, I have a nice intense +5 bow but it's not maximum possible attack, therefore I still horde and trade for every bow I get to combine for the perfect wep. If I get a bad roll it only delays the process, I will still combine all bows and get every one I can. Allowing me to re-roll bad intense doesn't change this process at all, it only makes it more fair (and shorter) for the work I have put in.
I don't think it would completely de-value weaker stat weapons, people who are seeking perfection will only chase perfect sat weps, but many people just want something that is very good (or just good) to get some nice speed or attack on as their hunting/farming/initial pvp weapon. If anything is lowers the value of perfect weapons because they are achievable by more people.
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#3 2017/11/04 22:37:30 |
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CCHRONER |
Even if you are able to combine 2 intense for a possible better or worse roll it is still the effort of making that intense (as Strelka stated), where getting from epic to intense is a 50% chance.
Then maybe if you are allowed to combine an intense with another intense you must use two intense weapons, with 100k or whatever but only has a 25% chance success rate? You don't have to keep it at 50. There are many scenarios you can do to set this up, either way it helps with a money sink but also get rid of intense weapons since you must combine 2 for 1
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[quote="CCHRONER"]Even if you are able to combine 2 intense for a possible better or worse roll it is still the effort of making that intense (as Strelka stated), where getting from epic to intense is a 50% chance.
Then maybe if you are allowed to combine an intense with another intense you must use two intense weapons, with 100k or whatever but only has a 25% chance success rate? You don't have to keep it at 50.
There are many scenarios you can do to set this up, either way it helps with a money sink but also get rid of intense weapons since you must combine 2 for 1[/quote]
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#4 2017/11/04 22:44:32 |
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JAHEIRA |
Iv made this exact same suggestion before
Tho playing more i disagree with it now The reason for this is. Everyone would just sit on items to combine, where as current the shit ints might be a amazing weap for someone that dosnt have/ not upgraded. Iv had my share of bad ints, someone has always took them off my hands
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[quote="JAHEIRA"]Iv made this exact same suggestion before
Tho playing more i disagree with it now
The reason for this is.
Everyone would just sit on items to combine, where as current the shit ints might be a amazing weap for someone that dosnt have/ not upgraded.
Iv had my share of bad ints, someone has always took them off my hands[/quote]
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#5 2017/11/04 22:57:16 |
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KEKKET |
Plz no. Combine has to stop at some point. Dont forget combine is gambling just like upgrades.
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#6 2017/11/05 08:21:00 |
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MILKY_SENPAI |
gets pretty depressing when every intense axe i combine that isnt M A X I M U M attack (as I try clean tab them) is utter junk and I end up just dropping them on the floor by wh or giving them to some other axe user that might use for lvling.
would love to be able to do something with them, and not feel like im just combining axes to make wh space
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[quote="MILKY_SENPAI"]gets pretty depressing when every intense axe i combine that isnt M A X I M U M attack (as I try clean tab them) is utter junk and I end up just dropping them on the floor by wh or giving them to some other axe user that might use for lvling.
would love to be able to do something with them, and not feel like im just combining axes to make wh space[/quote]
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#7 2017/11/05 11:46:49 |
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STRELKA |
"JAHEIRA" That's a fair point, really. But it works the other way too, and might easily stimulate and open up the economy. Currently by the time you use 120 skill weps you are already at mobs that drop them - and hunt them till level 100. If people knew that eventually - maybe its 10 epics for a good first-time roll, or 30 epics for 2 poor intenses and a re-roll on them for a good item, or 50 epics for 2 rerolls - they would get a decent intense for all their money and combine efforts - then suddenly every weapon has value. Not just 'potential' value as at the moment. I have intense grim bows so bad in my stash that level 65s in my guild don't even want them when they hit the stats to use, because they legit have better stat mal bows or epic crossbows. It's sad that I worked so hard to make these bows, costing 10 epics on average each. I'm not even actively trading bows off people at the moment, because I can't be bothered with the waste of money and effort that comes with rolling a good stat intense. With the suggested system: If you are a level 65 sword user, people are actually going to want to take your blue and purple spears/axes/knux off your hands with much more desire than present - because they know its gonna lead somewhere. So you can trade them for swords and make your own decent stash of upgradable ones by the time you get capped. Or you could work the combine system yourself and end up with some amazing weapons to trade for a great sword to use yourself. Currently, if you get a blue/green drop of any non-sword or non-bow weapon, it's pretty hard to shift it - let alone trade it for what you want.
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[quote="STRELKA"][quote="JAHEIRA"]
Everyone would just sit on items to combine, where as current the shit ints might be a amazing weap for someone that dosnt have/ not upgraded.
Iv had my share of bad ints, someone has always took them off my hands[/quote]
That's a fair point, really.
But it works the other way too, and might easily stimulate and open up the economy. Currently by the time you use 120 skill weps you are already at mobs that drop them - and hunt them till level 100. If people knew that eventually - maybe its 10 epics for a good first-time roll, or 30 epics for 2 poor intenses and a re-roll on them for a good item, or 50 epics for 2 rerolls - they would get a decent intense for all their money and combine efforts - then suddenly every weapon has value. Not just 'potential' value as at the moment.
I have intense grim bows so bad in my stash that level 65s in my guild don't even want them when they hit the stats to use, because they legit have better stat mal bows or epic crossbows. It's sad that I worked so hard to make these bows, costing 10 epics on average each. I'm not even actively trading bows off people at the moment, because I can't be bothered with the waste of money and effort that comes with rolling a good stat intense.
With the suggested system: If you are a level 65 sword user, people are actually going to want to take your blue and purple spears/axes/knux off your hands with much more desire than present - because they know its gonna lead somewhere. So you can trade them for swords and make your own decent stash of upgradable ones by the time you get capped. Or you could work the combine system yourself and end up with some amazing weapons to trade for a great sword to use yourself.
Currently, if you get a blue/green drop of any non-sword or non-bow weapon, it's pretty hard to shift it - let alone trade it for what you want.
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#8 2017/11/06 08:22:21 |
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JAHEIRA |
Think what needs looking at is the % crossover between tags, its probly to high for dsoma, even worse than a bad ints would be to get your first lego droped and it be a bad roll
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#9 2017/11/06 09:33:18 |
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HURRICANE |
seriously, are you trying to make the game worse? Its already fucked as it is with combine ingame. Combine should never have been put inplace. People now have +7 and +8 intense top range weps. Its a joke. Now your asking for combine to give u amazing intense items. It doesnt need implementing at all. Leave it as it is as its overpowered already.
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[quote="HURRICANE"]seriously, are you trying to make the game worse? Its already fucked as it is with combine ingame. Combine should never have been put inplace. People now have +7 and +8 intense top range weps. Its a joke. Now your asking for combine to give u amazing intense items. It doesnt need implementing at all. Leave it as it is as its overpowered already.[/quote]
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#10 2017/11/07 07:43:46 |
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JAHEIRA |
"HURRICANE"seriously, are you trying to make the game worse? Its already fucked as it is with combine ingame. Combine should never have been put inplace. People now have +7 and +8 intense top range weps. Its a joke. Now your asking for combine to give u amazing intense items. It doesnt need implementing at all. Leave it as it is as its overpowered already. What difference does it make if everyone has ? Maybe hsoma upgrades should be nerfed inline with dsoma, as we dont have any +7or+8 Lvl increase will come, new weap and armor which if the increase is enough ppl will swop over
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[quote="JAHEIRA"][quote="HURRICANE"]seriously, are you trying to make the game worse? Its already fucked as it is with combine ingame. Combine should never have been put inplace. People now have +7 and +8 intense top range weps. Its a joke. Now your asking for combine to give u amazing intense items. It doesnt need implementing at all. Leave it as it is as its overpowered already.[/quote]
What difference does it make if everyone has ? Maybe hsoma upgrades should be nerfed inline with dsoma, as we dont have any +7or+8
Lvl increase will come, new weap and armor which if the increase is enough ppl will swop over[/quote]
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#11 2017/11/07 08:49:23 |
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HURRICANE |
"JAHEIRA""HURRICANE"seriously, are you trying to make the game worse? Its already fucked as it is with combine ingame. Combine should never have been put inplace. People now have +7 and +8 intense top range weps. Its a joke. Now your asking for combine to give u amazing intense items. It doesnt need implementing at all. Leave it as it is as its overpowered already. Nerfed? Its too late for that. People will quit if they take their +8 items away. Also humans have better upgrades for a reason. This reason is devil's are way overpowered. Everyone else can have them, doesn't mean they can get a chance of having the best attack and speed intense weapon. Getting an intense is good enough. When level increase comes and new weps and armours will be added, i still don't think people will stop using their +8 items when they have +5 A speed Bow with 5 better attack. Sorry but this change does not need to be implemented. Your just all asking for it easy. Its alot easier to get an intense using combine and now ur wanting the top intense item from combine. all i can say is lol!
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[quote="HURRICANE"][quote="JAHEIRA"][quote="HURRICANE"]seriously, are you trying to make the game worse? Its already fucked as it is with combine ingame. Combine should never have been put inplace. People now have +7 and +8 intense top range weps. Its a joke. Now your asking for combine to give u amazing intense items. It doesnt need implementing at all. Leave it as it is as its overpowered already.[/quote]
What difference does it make if everyone has ? Maybe hsoma upgrades should be nerfed inline with dsoma, as we dont have any +7or+8
Lvl increase will come, new weap and armor which if the increase is enough ppl will swop over[/quote]
Nerfed? Its too late for that. People will quit if they take their +8 items away. Also humans have better upgrades for a reason. This reason is devil's are way overpowered. Everyone else can have them, doesn't mean they can get a chance of having the best attack and speed intense weapon. Getting an intense is good enough. When level increase comes and new weps and armours will be added, i still don't think people will stop using their +8 items when they have +5 A speed Bow with 5 better attack. Sorry but this change does not need to be implemented. Your just all asking for it easy. Its alot easier to get an intense using combine and now ur wanting the top intense item from combine. all i can say is lol![/quote]
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#12 2017/11/07 09:49:50 |
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STRELKA |
Love the attitude:
'Soma was harder back in the day, therefore any small changes to improve the quality of life of the game to retain the playerbase are bad' I hope you chose to play without clicklock, in native resolution? Wouldn't want the game to be too easy now would we? Hope you log out of town so you dont get any ez-mode rested exp. If the game wants to keep it's player numbers then there are certain quality of life changes that address issues that make people quit. Yes they make the game a little bit easier than it was before, but they also remove some of the frustrations that make people decide that playing soma isn't a good use of their time.
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[quote="STRELKA"]Love the attitude:
'Soma was harder back in the day, therefore any small changes to improve the quality of life of the game to retain the playerbase are bad'
I hope you chose to play without clicklock, in native resolution? Wouldn't want the game to be too easy now would we? Hope you log out of town so you dont get any ez-mode rested exp.
If the game wants to keep it's player numbers then there are certain quality of life changes that address issues that make people quit. Yes they make the game a little bit easier than it was before, but they also remove some of the frustrations that make people decide that playing soma isn't a good use of their time.[/quote]
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#13 2017/11/07 10:45:56 |
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JHAELIEN |
I think the success rate was simply too high on combines. And the better the tag the more weapons it should require. 2 Hardened to make a Rare, 3 Rare for an Epic and 3 Epic for an average Intense and 4 Epic for a decent/high roll Intense. 2 weapons to make any tag you want is too low and the barr cost is also too low should increase by tag.
Also you shouldn't get back a weapon 100% of the time by receiving a bad roll, it should have a chance to outright fail and you lose both. Personally if it's to stay as is, I'd have cut combine off at epic and left intense to be obtained by drop only.
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[quote="JHAELIEN"]I think the success rate was simply too high on combines. And the better the tag the more weapons it should require. 2 Hardened to make a Rare, 3 Rare for an Epic and 3 Epic for an average Intense and 4 Epic for a decent/high roll Intense. 2 weapons to make any tag you want is too low and the barr cost is also too low should increase by tag.
Also you shouldn't get back a weapon 100% of the time by receiving a bad roll, it should have a chance to outright fail and you lose both. Personally if it's to stay as is, I'd have cut combine off at epic and left intense to be obtained by drop only.[/quote]
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#14 2017/11/07 13:02:14 |
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JAHEIRA |
"JHAELIEN"I think the success rate was simply too high on combines. And the better the tag the more weapons it should require. 2 Hardened to make a Rare, 3 Rare for an Epic and 3 Epic for an average Intense and 4 Epic for a decent/high roll Intense. 2 weapons to make any tag you want is too low and the barr cost is also too low should increase by tag. tbf i think they have nerfed the rate of tags since first introducing it, or at least thats how it feels now to what i remember it was like i do think when/if we get a new set of weaps, i think they should to excluded from combine (if they are going to be a improvement on current ints tags
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[quote="JAHEIRA"][quote="JHAELIEN"]I think the success rate was simply too high on combines. And the better the tag the more weapons it should require. 2 Hardened to make a Rare, 3 Rare for an Epic and 3 Epic for an average Intense and 4 Epic for a decent/high roll Intense. 2 weapons to make any tag you want is too low and the barr cost is also too low should increase by tag.
Also you shouldn't get back a weapon 100% of the time by receiving a bad roll, it should have a chance to outright fail and you lose both. Personally if it's to stay as is, I'd have cut combine off at epic and left intense to be obtained by drop only.[/quote]
tbf i think they have nerfed the rate of tags since first introducing it, or at least thats how it feels now to what i remember it was like
i do think when/if we get a new set of weaps, i think they should to excluded from combine (if they are going to be a improvement on current ints tags[/quote]
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#15 2017/11/07 19:16:28 |
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