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PAPAPILAS |
I think that some of the work into this new patch is slowly balancing out mage vs melee, but still some work to be done tho. You said mages are only good for boss kills, would like to know which bosses. There is only a very small number of bosses that mages are good at, when do you ever see china take Benysamy to a boss other then Tiresias, Never... They don't even use him to farm mags. This is a much bigger issue then melee vs mage.
Just want to add the stat requirements for all the new weapons are way to low.
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[quote="PAPAPILAS"]I think that some of the work into this new patch is slowly balancing out mage vs melee, but still some work to be done tho. You said mages are only good for boss kills, would like to know which bosses. There is only a very small number of bosses that mages are good at, when do you ever see china take Benysamy to a boss other then Tiresias, Never... They don't even use him to farm mags. This is a much bigger issue then melee vs mage.
Just want to add the stat requirements for all the new weapons are way to low. [/quote]
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#16 2018/11/25 01:18:35 |
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SEVENTH_SON |
"NITE"I've been really dreading making this thread because I know the kind of answers people will reply with and on top of that I don't want to be called "ungrateful" Mages are for Healing in Battle. Not for Soloing .Every other Game ive played Mages are a support Class. Healing the tank. Archers protect the Mage no??
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[quote="SEVENTH_SON"][quote="NITE"]I've been really dreading making this thread because I know the kind of answers people will reply with and on top of that I don't want to be called "ungrateful"
But here it goes never the less.
The big issue with Mages both in Hsoma and Dsoma is that the class it self is only viable if you can cast. For example I was informed that in Dsoma you get 10 seconds of free casting with 4th aura but with a 60 second cooldown, so you get a 10 second pvp window then you have to run or die (in hsoma you don't get this choice so you either tp or die twice for the invul) which means there is no fighting chance for neither of us. Secondly 3rd and 5th axe auras remove any auras so if you cast 4th staff and you get 5th axed, you're pretty fucked, and you still have to wait for your cooldown and by the time you can use 4th again their 5th is back before your 4th so its really pointless trying to fight as a mage.
Now in hsoma the problems are pretty much the same if not equal, we can't cast because of the vast amount of archers in the game, a level 100 could easily stop a level 120 mage from casting. Everybody has super noob with a machine gun bow these days with less than 100 INT, the reason behind this is very simple, they see that mages are not a threat and choose not to level INT at all. They could argue that they just want a high dex char blah blah blah but they don't care that they have low INT because if they lock on a mage with their bow they have to run and precast so they can at least cast one spell before they are locked on again.
So to put it very simply, we have a class which is not viable and also unplayable for both races, no one is leveling their mage because it''s not worth spending 1k hours on a class that wont be able to fight and do damage in a pvp environment. I know of a lot of mages that have stopped playing because of this and of some mages that play very little because the grind isn't worth their time and effort to end up with a char only useful for bosses. And If anybody thinks dex mage is a viable option, it isnt. You loose dps, it makes MA rings pointless to make because you'll have to wear dex acces / evasion in order to cast against 170+ dex archers with 220+ str.
Now I would like to name a few mages that I would like to hear from.
Dsoma Merlin, Monster, Bevan, Psychotix, Wezzek, Lazarus, Ibex,
Hsoma Yagudo, Rocky1, Brave, Paparas, Papapilas, Yomi, Malycon, Devula. Shailo
I'm Sorry if I've missed your name
But I would also like to hear from everyone else.
Thank you for reading.[/quote]
Mages are for Healing in Battle. Not for Soloing .Every other Game ive played Mages are a support Class. Healing the tank. Archers protect the Mage no??[/quote]
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#17 2018/11/25 01:58:57 |
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BRAINSTORM |
Just want to add the stat requirements for all the new weapons are way to low. hsoma or dsoma? |
#18 2018/11/25 01:59:10 |
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ULTIMATE |
The way Soma works would not allow the cast inturruption to be removed, mages would be stupidly over powered. You’ll have pure axe/int characters running about demolishing everyone and taking no damage.
People seem to forget the role of a mage.. a mage in ANY mmorpg is a glass cannon, it’s supposed to pvp alongside a tank/aggro. IMO nothing needs balancing. I’ve seen high end mages 3 hit people with machine gun bows with spirit sword... I do however, for the sake of soma in general, think capping the new weapons at +5 is a good idea...
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[quote="ULTIMATE"]The way Soma works would not allow the cast inturruption to be removed, mages would be stupidly over powered. You’ll have pure axe/int characters running about demolishing everyone and taking no damage.
People seem to forget the role of a mage.. a mage in ANY mmorpg is a glass cannon, it’s supposed to pvp alongside a tank/aggro.
IMO nothing needs balancing. I’ve seen high end mages 3 hit people with machine gun bows with spirit sword...
I do however, for the sake of soma in general, think capping the new weapons at +5 is a good idea...[/quote]
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#19 2018/11/25 02:36:50 |
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CUPID |
the day rocky is able to free cast on people will be best day of my life :) 68% proc with 229 int, he 1 hits most characters in the game now even with AOE spells. Gonna be carnage. bring on the mage to cast uninterrupted i say :)
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#20 2018/11/25 02:54:20 |
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BRAINSTORM |
"CUPID"the day rocky is able to free cast on people will be best day of my life :) 68% proc with 229 int, he 1 hits most characters in the game now even with AOE spells. Gonna be carnage. bring on the mage to cast uninterrupted i say :) if mages get uninterrupted cast then nerf proc % or bring back magic dam cap ;)
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[quote="BRAINSTORM"][quote="CUPID"]the day rocky is able to free cast on people will be best day of my life :) 68% proc with 229 int, he 1 hits most characters in the game now even with AOE spells. Gonna be carnage. bring on the mage to cast uninterrupted i say :)
+1 [/quote]
if mages get uninterrupted cast then nerf proc % or bring back magic dam cap ;)[/quote]
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#21 2018/11/25 03:13:47 |
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ARLO |
"NITE"I've been really dreading making this thread because I know the kind of answers people will reply with and on top of that I don't want to be called "ungrateful" I've done some testing since latest patch and I think Mages got to big of a boost with it. The Dexy archer builds you mention all have under 120 int (if they get to much they get stuck in the middle road where they're good against nobody like Nuclear said) They are also very hard to gear up to be good for Pvp IMO, +5 everything is a must atleast. A 230 int mage with ONLY a +1 DB proc set (26% set/chance to proc) can one shot any of these archer builds with weaken and a solo DB proc.
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[quote="ARLO"][quote="NITE"]I've been really dreading making this thread because I know the kind of answers people will reply with and on top of that I don't want to be called "ungrateful"
But here it goes never the less.
The big issue with Mages both in Hsoma and Dsoma is that the class it self is only viable if you can cast. For example I was informed that in Dsoma you get 10 seconds of free casting with 4th aura but with a 60 second cooldown, so you get a 10 second pvp window then you have to run or die (in hsoma you don't get this choice so you either tp or die twice for the invul) which means there is no fighting chance for neither of us. Secondly 3rd and 5th axe auras remove any auras so if you cast 4th staff and you get 5th axed, you're pretty fucked, and you still have to wait for your cooldown and by the time you can use 4th again their 5th is back before your 4th so its really pointless trying to fight as a mage.
Now in hsoma the problems are pretty much the same if not equal, we can't cast because of the vast amount of archers in the game, a level 100 could easily stop a level 120 mage from casting. Everybody has super noob with a machine gun bow these days with less than 100 INT, the reason behind this is very simple, they see that mages are not a threat and choose not to level INT at all. They could argue that they just want a high dex char blah blah blah but they don't care that they have low INT because if they lock on a mage with their bow they have to run and precast so they can at least cast one spell before they are locked on again.
So to put it very simply, we have a class which is not viable and also unplayable for both races, no one is leveling their mage because it''s not worth spending 1k hours on a class that wont be able to fight and do damage in a pvp environment. I know of a lot of mages that have stopped playing because of this and of some mages that play very little because the grind isn't worth their time and effort to end up with a char only useful for bosses. And If anybody thinks dex mage is a viable option, it isnt. You loose dps, it makes MA rings pointless to make because you'll have to wear dex acces / evasion in order to cast against 170+ dex archers with 220+ str.
Now I would like to name a few mages that I would like to hear from.
Dsoma Merlin, Monster, Bevan, Psychotix, Wezzek, Lazarus, Ibex,
Hsoma Yagudo, Rocky1, Brave, Paparas, Papapilas, Yomi, Malycon, Devula. Shailo
I'm Sorry if I've missed your name
But I would also like to hear from everyone else.
Thank you for reading.[/quote]
I've done some testing since latest patch and I think Mages got to big of a boost with it.
The Dexy archer builds you mention all have under 120 int (if they get to much they get stuck in the middle road where they're good against nobody like Nuclear said)
They are also very hard to gear up to be good for Pvp IMO, +5 everything is a must atleast.
A 230 int mage with ONLY a +1 DB proc set (26% set/chance to proc) can one shot any of these archer builds with weaken and a solo DB proc.
[/quote]
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#22 2018/11/25 06:04:23 |
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YUKA |
If you look at it from a PVE perspective... The reason I have high dex and no int is cus that's how I try to last hit the bosses. By actually being able to hit them. Mages on the other hand have HUGE dmg per hit, but just slower. From a PVE perspective, mages do very very well.
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[quote="YUKA"]If you look at it from a PVE perspective... The reason I have high dex and no int is cus that's how I try to last hit the bosses. By actually being able to hit them. Mages on the other hand have HUGE dmg per hit, but just slower. From a PVE perspective, mages do very very well.[/quote]
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#23 2018/11/25 06:11:23 |
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ISELIX |
The problem is with the game mechanics, I get casting is a problem for mages, but when they do cast the damage is insane. Then add weaken! But what is the solution? If they have uninterrupted casting, what speed? What's the damage cap?
I think you could disable weaken for PvP, give hsoma 4th staff and make it better (10 secs free casting no mitigation even from stone with a reasonable cool down) and make tweaks to some spells... for example some spells can't be interrupted like blind or confuse or giggle, the ones that don't damage could be free, or at least made easier to use. But you forget the biggest issue. Melee characters miss! Spellcasting can't be 100% hit rate when melee isn't. Sidenote... to everyone saying just use evasion... don't forget accuracy mitigates this, as does any dex acc. To conclude, mages in PvP would be too powerful unless any changes were really thought out. The very best mages have far more damage potential than melee
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[quote="ISELIX"]The problem is with the game mechanics, I get casting is a problem for mages, but when they do cast the damage is insane. Then add weaken! But what is the solution? If they have uninterrupted casting, what speed? What's the damage cap?
I think you could disable weaken for PvP, give hsoma 4th staff and make it better (10 secs free casting no mitigation even from stone with a reasonable cool down) and make tweaks to some spells... for example some spells can't be interrupted like blind or confuse or giggle, the ones that don't damage could be free, or at least made easier to use.
But you forget the biggest issue. Melee characters miss! Spellcasting can't be 100% hit rate when melee isn't.
Sidenote... to everyone saying just use evasion... don't forget accuracy mitigates this, as does any dex acc.
To conclude, mages in PvP would be too powerful unless any changes were really thought out. The very best mages have far more damage potential than melee[/quote]
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#24 2018/11/25 06:52:30 |
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DR_EVIL |
I don’t agree mage isn’t viable in PVP, it just requires more skill than other classes and adapted tactics. Utilised correctly a mage in PvP is an absolute nightmare for their opponents - look at someone like Ganon for instance.
I think if a 4th staff was introduced for hsoma it’d have to be about half the duration of the dsoma equivalent or it could get pretty ridiculous, especially at WOTW.
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[quote="DR_EVIL"]I don’t agree mage isn’t viable in PVP, it just requires more skill than other classes and adapted tactics. Utilised correctly a mage in PvP is an absolute nightmare for their opponents - look at someone like Ganon for instance.
I think if a 4th staff was introduced for hsoma it’d have to be about half the duration of the dsoma equivalent or it could get pretty ridiculous, especially at WOTW.[/quote]
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#25 2018/11/25 09:13:29 |
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DR_EVIL |
I do think taking away archer’s click lock when someone feathers would negate some issues mage's do face while also balancing PVP in general a little more.
Mage's don't even have click lock at all, so maybe that could be looked at also. It's a pain at bosses having to hold right click the entire time and even then with them moving/people moving around you end up miss-clicking at times. In PVP it's also a disadvantage that only mage's have to suffer.
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[quote="DR_EVIL"]I do think taking away archer’s click lock when someone feathers would negate some issues mage's do face while also balancing PVP in general a little more.
Mage's don't even have click lock at all, so maybe that could be looked at also. It's a pain at bosses having to hold right click the entire time and even then with them moving/people moving around you end up miss-clicking at times. In PVP it's also a disadvantage that only mage's have to suffer.[/quote]
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#26 2018/11/25 10:03:45 |
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ULTIMATE |
+1..
Feathers should ‘unlock’ the click targeting off you. |
#27 2018/11/25 10:15:40 |
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MEDELIM |
Basically if you are new to the game you have to be a Melee char forget Mage...
Melee chars better for pvp and bosses. The only way you will build a good character is by going to events and killing bosses, this can only really be done if your a worrier class. Sad but true.
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[quote="MEDELIM"]Basically if you are new to the game you have to be a Melee char forget Mage...
Melee chars better for pvp and bosses.
The only way you will build a good character is by going to events and killing bosses, this can only really be done if your a worrier class.
Sad but true.[/quote]
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#28 2018/11/25 13:42:55 |
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PROWLER |
"MEDELIM" You also have to be Chinese ..... |
#29 2018/11/25 14:35:47 |
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MERLIN |
I don't know hsoma much as have never really played a top level mage with high str,
Yes mage definitely takes a certain amount of patience and skill compared to other chars, mainly knowing when to get out of the way before archers start getting shots off Mages imo got a big damage boost this patch, the strength of dragon breath proc if you got a decent set is crazy good (much easier hsoma side as dsoma rubies are crazy expensive) [side issue but with the tablet form being cross race I think you will find a lot more x-world trading, or people with the right connections to high level hsoma benefitting a lot more] and all the other procs are stronger than the old style too Their damage taken hasnt improved any other than the rise in hp through levels gained. I still get 4 hit by an archer (possibly 3 hit in the right pod gear) Equally so I can drop people in 2 hits IF I proc which is nocertainty, more true to the form of glass cannon which I dont mind other than the fact dsoma doesnt really have big numbers at the minute and mages are targetted straight up due to their damage output (***again as stated if a feather removed all click locks on you this would be a vast improvement***) I do think being able to increase cast speed by upping staff would be interesting, as it stands i can be 90% through a cast and the first shot of any mellee wep stops it because its instant Myself and psychotix were both level119 a few weeks ago and were stopped by 2 level 110 archers because they just ran when we cast 4th aura (again making this invisible to other chars could be a vast improvement) and when targetted by 2 archers of they time a 4th its guaranteed death so we couldnt stand and fight as we dont survive long enough due to the dps of archer Maybe buffing all the other mellee classes again would stop everyone rolling archers and could make a change too (dsoma side as the other mellee classes are fast becoming extinct) **edit I will try dig out a video of myself vs slayer in arena or make a new one if I cant, it shows while 4th is up we are relatively equal, I do more damage per hit WHEN I proc but he hits consistently at a much faster rate, removing interrupted casting wouldn't make mage any more OP than what archer currently is (maybe remove weaken proc)
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[quote="MERLIN"]I don't know hsoma much as have never really played a top level mage with high str,
Yes mage definitely takes a certain amount of patience and skill compared to other chars, mainly knowing when to get out of the way before archers start getting shots off
Mages imo got a big damage boost this patch, the strength of dragon breath proc if you got a decent set is crazy good (much easier hsoma side as dsoma rubies are crazy expensive) [side issue but with the tablet form being cross race I think you will find a lot more x-world trading, or people with the right connections to high level hsoma benefitting a lot more] and all the other procs are stronger than the old style too
Their damage taken hasnt improved any other than the rise in hp through levels gained. I still get 4 hit by an archer (possibly 3 hit in the right pod gear)
Equally so I can drop people in 2 hits IF I proc which is nocertainty, more true to the form of glass cannon which I dont mind other than the fact dsoma doesnt really have big numbers at the minute and mages are targetted straight up due to their damage output (***again as stated if a feather removed all click locks on you this would be a vast improvement***)
I do think being able to increase cast speed by upping staff would be interesting, as it stands i can be 90% through a cast and the first shot of any mellee wep stops it because its instant
Myself and psychotix were both level119 a few weeks ago and were stopped by 2 level 110 archers because they just ran when we cast 4th aura (again making this invisible to other chars could be a vast improvement) and when targetted by 2 archers of they time a 4th its guaranteed death so we couldnt stand and fight as we dont survive long enough due to the dps of archer
Maybe buffing all the other mellee classes again would stop everyone rolling archers and could make a change too (dsoma side as the other mellee classes are fast becoming extinct)
**edit I will try dig out a video of myself vs slayer in arena or make a new one if I cant, it shows while 4th is up we are relatively equal, I do more damage per hit WHEN I proc but he hits consistently at a much faster rate, removing interrupted casting wouldn't make mage any more OP than what archer currently is (maybe remove weaken proc)[/quote]
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#30 2018/11/25 15:03:57 |
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