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The impracticality of Str/Dex in hsoma.
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SHATTERSTAR |
As a player who hates int, agree with this post 100%. Just by attending GVW and WoTW it seems you need int to play the 'fun' aspects of the game. Which may well change at higher levels but for now it is ridiculous.
Last GVW made me rethink whether it is worth the grind, I don't understand how your own characters attack can be lower that its defence, this really should not be the case at any level.
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[quote="SHATTERSTAR"]As a player who hates int, agree with this post 100%. Just by attending GVW and WoTW it seems you need int to play the 'fun' aspects of the game. Which may well change at higher levels but for now it is ridiculous.
Last GVW made me rethink whether it is worth the grind, I don't understand how your own characters attack can be lower that its defence, this really should not be the case at any level.[/quote]
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#16 2013/12/12 10:16:51 |
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S0RCERER |
"SHATTERSTAR"I don't understand how your own characters attack can be lower that its defence, this really should not be the case at any level. I agree wholeheartedly. But if you're being destroyed by INT, get some yourself. Invest a week into it, it's incredibly quick on Hsoma.
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[quote="S0RCERER"][quote="SHATTERSTAR"]I don't understand how your own characters attack can be lower that its defence, this really should not be the case at any level.[/quote]
I agree wholeheartedly.
But if you're being destroyed by INT, get some yourself.
Invest a week into it, it's incredibly quick on Hsoma.[/quote]
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#17 2013/12/12 10:30:26 |
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SCOIN |
"S0RCERER"If you have 30~40 less INT than the top mages on Hsoma, then you damn well deserve to be taking truckloads of damage from INT. At 30 to 40 more int they do truck loads. Int is far op compared to melee currently. |
#18 2013/12/12 10:31:30 |
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TOLIC |
you see people holding gvw stone with full int gear on yet int would still do more damage to them than melee would.
even the boss soul ring rewards benefit mages more than warriors with them having a brand new int ring and warriors get a +1/2 upgrade |
#19 2013/12/12 10:35:57 |
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S0RCERER |
"SCOIN""S0RCERER"If you have 30~40 less INT than the top mages on Hsoma, then you damn well deserve to be taking truckloads of damage from INT. Nobody's disputing that, the point was that you wouldn't be doing 100+dmg (outside of weaken) and as a result, the removal of the damage cap plays no part here. "TOLIC"you see people holding gvw stone with full int gear on yet int would still do more damage to them than melee would. This is a case of melee being far too weak (on hsoma). As Shatterstar stated, it makes no sense whatsoever to have defence higher than attack. Pretty much every weapon on Hsoma needs 10~10 increase in damage (before tags).
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[quote="S0RCERER"][quote="SCOIN"][quote="S0RCERER"]If you have 30~40 less INT than the top mages on Hsoma, then you damn well deserve to be taking truckloads of damage from INT.[/quote]
At 30 to 40 more int they do truck loads.
Int is far op compared to melee currently.
[/quote]
Nobody's disputing that, the point was that you wouldn't be doing 100+dmg (outside of weaken) and as a result, the removal of the damage cap plays no part here.
[quote="TOLIC"]you see people holding gvw stone with full int gear on yet int would still do more damage to them than melee would.[/quote]
This is a case of melee being far too weak (on hsoma).
As Shatterstar stated, it makes no sense whatsoever to have defence higher than attack.
Pretty much every weapon on Hsoma needs 10~10 increase in damage (before tags).[/quote]
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#20 2013/12/12 10:43:57 |
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SCOIN |
"S0RCERER" Another way of putting that is: Int is op relative to melee |
#21 2013/12/12 10:47:35 |
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BELKA |
"SHATTERSTAR"As a player who hates int, agree with this post 100%. Just by attending GVW and WoTW it seems you need int to play the 'fun' aspects of the game. Which may well change at higher levels but for now it is ridiculous. I don't mind grinding up my INT for defensive reasons, and I don't think you (or anyone) does either. Problem is I feel forced to use it for offense, it isnt just a defensive thing. For example, a friend has 25Str/15Dex more than me and almost exactly the same int. However, he does far far more damage to me with int than melee - so where is the value and benefit in the 300~ hours of difficult high-stat melee training? Yes INT is easy to do, and everyone should have to do it, and it should be a perfectly viable playstyle, but it shouldn't be the only one. Especially when the longest and hardest part of the game is leveling STR/DEX. To a degree it will improve with upgrades - especially tagged 130 skill weps and speed upgrades - but the accuracy and evasion changes almost negate that. It also doesn't change the fact that leveling your dex to 90+ to use stinger bow, then get an epic/intense dropped from a boss, then get a successfull couple of upgrades is a little bit harder and longer than prismatics till 110 int "TOLIC"you see people holding gvw stone with full int gear on yet int would still do more damage to them than melee would. Perfect way to sum all this up.
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[quote="BELKA"][quote="SHATTERSTAR"]As a player who hates int, agree with this post 100%. Just by attending GVW and WoTW it seems you need int to play the 'fun' aspects of the game. Which may well change at higher levels but for now it is ridiculous.
[/quote]
I don't mind grinding up my INT for defensive reasons, and I don't think you (or anyone) does either. Problem is I feel forced to use it for offense, it isnt just a defensive thing.
For example, a friend has 25Str/15Dex more than me and almost exactly the same int. However, he does far far more damage to me with int than melee - so where is the value and benefit in the 300~ hours of difficult high-stat melee training?
Yes INT is easy to do, and everyone should have to do it, and it should be a perfectly viable playstyle, but it [b]shouldn't be the only one[/b]. Especially when the longest and hardest part of the game is leveling STR/DEX. To a degree it will improve with upgrades - especially tagged 130 skill weps and speed upgrades - but the accuracy and evasion changes almost negate that. It also doesn't change the fact that leveling your dex to 90+ to use stinger bow, then get an epic/intense dropped from a boss, then get a successfull couple of upgrades is a [b]little[/b] bit harder and longer than prismatics till 110 int
[quote="TOLIC"]you see people holding gvw stone with full int gear on yet int would still do more damage to them than melee would.
even the boss soul ring rewards benefit mages more than warriors with them having a brand new int ring and warriors get a +1/2 upgrade[/quote]
Perfect way to sum all this up.[/quote]
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#22 2013/12/12 10:52:46 |
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S0RCERER |
"SCOIN""S0RCERER" More accurate would be "Defense is OP relative to Attack". If you nerfed magic, then you'd all just be using Melee in its current state and PvP would consist of who runs out of durability first.
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[quote="S0RCERER"][quote="SCOIN"][quote="S0RCERER"]
This is a case of melee being far too weak (on hsoma).
.[/quote]
Another way of putting that is:
Int is op relative to melee
[/quote]
More accurate would be "Defense is OP relative to Attack".
If you nerfed magic, then you'd all just be using Melee in its current state and PvP would consist of who runs out of durability first.[/quote]
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#23 2013/12/12 10:53:06 |
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BASIL |
Far to late to do anything tbh.
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#24 2013/12/12 10:56:12 |
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BELKA |
"S0RCERER" Aka Dsoma. 
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#25 2013/12/12 10:57:40 |
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S0RCERER |
"BELKA"Aka Dsoma. Yup, people only start killing eachother (if within same level bracket) by late 60s. Before then, it's a 'durability burn fest'. Again, to do with armour benefiting much more than weapons with the tag system (even though Dsoma melee weapons benefit massively!).
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[quote="S0RCERER"][quote="BELKA"]Aka Dsoma.[/quote]
Yup, people only start killing eachother (if within same level bracket) by late 60s.
Before then, it's a 'durability burn fest'.
Again, to do with armour benefiting much more than weapons with the tag system (even though Dsoma melee weapons benefit massively!).[/quote]
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#26 2013/12/12 11:02:50 |
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SHATTERSTAR |
"BASIL"Far to late to do anything tbh. Not really, if a change is needed a change is needed. It is never too late to change anything, that's a life lesson there my friend. |
#27 2013/12/12 11:13:04 |
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IPHIOS |
It is not until you hit later game weapons that melee begins to do some damage. Int damage is irrelevant.
If someone has "30-40" more than you in any stat then they will use that to take you down... Soma is not a game where by you can lag behind in any stat and still expect to be able to defend from its attack - whether that be int str or dex. You are forced to obtain defence from all three. Just build a reasonably balanced char and then choose what to spend your limited exp on from there. Whether that be continue to be balanced or excel in one area. Its all simple maths ;o
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[quote="IPHIOS"]It is not until you hit later game weapons that melee begins to do some damage. Int damage is irrelevant.
If someone has "30-40" more than you in [b]any[/b] stat then they will use that to take you down...
Soma is not a game where by you can lag behind in any stat and still expect to be able to defend from its attack - whether that be int str or dex. You are forced to obtain defence from all three.
Just build a reasonably balanced char and then choose what to spend your limited exp on from there. Whether that be continue to be balanced or excel in one area.
Its all simple maths ;o [/quote]
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#28 2013/12/12 11:21:35 |
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_SEPHIROTH_ |
Extra int upgrades are easy to come by. Red dragon tablets (+1str) are so much rarer than tablet of wisdoms (+1 int)
Mage hero top 5-8 MA Warp neck 0-9 MA basic (1-10 rare) Necro charm +2 int = 7-19 magic attack from easily accessible items Vs Warrior hero top +2 (most warriors I know went mage top) ×2 ring of fighters 2-4 attack power So just 4-6 attack power from easily accessible items (Correct me if I'm wrong I've not done the research)
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[quote="_SEPHIROTH_"]Extra int upgrades are easy to come by. Red dragon tablets (+1str) are so much rarer than tablet of wisdoms (+1 int)
Mage hero top 5-8 MA
Warp neck 0-9 MA basic (1-10 rare)
Necro charm +2 int
= 7-19 magic attack from easily accessible items
Vs
Warrior hero top +2 (most warriors I know went mage top)
×2 ring of fighters 2-4 attack power
So just 4-6 attack power from easily accessible items
(Correct me if I'm wrong I've not done the research)[/quote]
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#29 2013/12/12 11:28:13 |
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IPHIOS |
"_SEPHIROTH_"Extra int upgrades are easy to come by. Red dragon tablets (+1str) are so much rarer than tablet of wisdoms (+1 int) Probably the most sensible argument in this thread. Melee based access could do with a bonus to be brought in line with magic based.
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[quote="IPHIOS"][quote="_SEPHIROTH_"]Extra int upgrades are easy to come by. Red dragon tablets (+1str) are so much rarer than tablet of wisdoms (+1 int)
Mage hero top 5-8 MA
Warp neck 0-9 MA basic (1-10 rare)
Necro charm +2 int
= 7-19 magic attack from easily accessible items
Vs
Warrior hero top +2 (most warriors I know went mage top)
×2 ring of fighters 2-4 attack power
So just 4-6 attack power from easily accessible items
(Correct me if I'm wrong I've not done the research)[/quote]
Probably the most sensible argument in this thread.
Melee based access could do with a bonus to be brought in line with magic based.[/quote]
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#30 2013/12/12 11:31:22 |
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