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[quote="LUPISCUS"]and the guy with 150+ craft skill... with his 60+ eps and 7 large rubies ..feels he has more chance of buying a bow or an axe than actually upgrading one himself, because of all the fails he's had..what do we tell him? its just rng, and its fair for everyone? Wotever tbh... just seems to be a little ''too much stick, and not enough carrot'' in the upgrade system[/quote]

[quote="SAL3M"][quote="LUPISCUS"]''just rng'' those magical words...why not make it skill based ..with every 1 skill adding to the chance of success.. not just some supposed increase in success at 150 or 200 ..make every skill count.. for everyone. Anyway... just an idea .. enjoy ur good luck doing 10 upgrades in a row flawless..the rest of us can dream[/quote] I don't know if you ever recorded any data sets for attempts v successes at various skill levels (i.e. 100-150, 150-200) but if you did and you give them to me I can calculate whether your success rate improved or not within some tolerance. I'd kind of like to know because i'm not going to bother crafting past 100 on dsoma if it turns out to be a crock of shit that % goes up at 150 like with the gradual improvement over 100 skill in esoma that I think Ravensoul mentioned earlier.[/quote]

[quote="LUPISCUS"]nah i dont write stuff down sal3m .. the real flickthebean might have such figures if he's still around. i do know.. out of 50+ psycho bows in the last 12 months, not one of tham has gone above +3 and the majority failed at +0 or +1 ( well one i gave away a few weeks ago excluded )[/quote]

[quote="SAL3M"][quote="LUPISCUS"]nah i dont write stuff down sal3m .. the real flickthebean might have such figures if he's still around[/quote] No worries - the offer is there is you want to tally success v fail for say 50 attempts each for whatever you have 200 skill in v something you have 150-200 and another between 100-150, assuming all crafting has the same %.[/quote]

[quote="LUPISCUS"]200 skill did have a noticeable enough difference in success up to a few months ago.. but recently this seems to have diminished. This ofc could just be luck and rng...... but that doesnt help when ur pumping items into the anvil with as much chance of winning on a fruit machine down the local arcade.[/quote]

[quote="CARNAGE"]People said this a long time ago that 200 skill literally had minimal benefits over 150 and apart from the extra srs but you went and got it anyway. Now you've realised why this was said. [/quote]

[quote="LUPISCUS"]It's a burden im happy to live with x i crafted some whopping stingers..just none have survived upgrading. Was hoping to up a few and sell them...but cant even make myself 1 ..nvm have surplus to sell ;/ Back on topic... the 150 skill crafter who is offering 60+ eps and 7 large rubies and his kitchen sink for a nice bwa or stinger.. because his experience at the anvil is so awful .. i can totally relate to that. That really isnt how it should be tho ..surely?[/quote]

[quote="CARNAGE"]Not saying you shouldn't be happy with achieving 200 skill but there's good reasons why the meta has always been 150 instead of 200, the time and mats required for the "gain" just aren't worth. [/quote]

[quote="SAL3M"]Tbf though unless somebody has calculated it within a reasonable pre-determined significance level i'm dubious 150>100 after reading this thread and learning people were mislead about crafting in esoma.[/quote]

[quote="LUPISCUS"]well, u mayb right.. but u dont get changes unless u ask for them. Some players get changes done when they ask.. There's quite a few crafters now 170+ and a couple approaching 200. Would be nice if the effort was rewarded. It's some serious effort gettin the 200. it doesnt come easy..at all[/quote]

[quote="RAVENSOUL"]FlickTheBean 100skill 150skill 200skill +1 56% 67% 68% +2 52% 64% 66% +3 48% 61% 64% +4 44% 58% 62% +5 40% 55% 60% +6 36% 52% 58% +7 32% 49% 56% +8 28% 46% 54% Rolling Odds (+0~+X) Edit due to questions: (Think like an Accumulator bet) 100skill; +0~+1: 56% +0~+2: 29.12% +0~+3: 13.9776% +0~+4: 6.150144% +0~+5: 2.4600576% +0~+6: 0.885629736% +0~+7: 0.28340151552% +0~+8: 0.0793524243456% 150skill; +0~+1: 67% +0~+2: 42.88% +0~+3: 26.1568% +0~+4: 15.170944% +0~+5: 8.3440192% +0~+6: 4.338889984% +0~+7: 2.12605609216% +0~+8: 0.9779858023936% 200skill +0~+1: 68% +0~+2: 44.88% +0~+3: 28.7232% +0~+4: 17.808384% +0~+5: 10.6850304% +0~+6: 6.197317632% +0~+7: 3.47049787392% +0~+8: 1.8740688519168% So as you can see from the above information. Before you press upgrade, pray to jesus, satan and the wizard of oz, spin round three times, throw a bowl of salt over your shoulder, spin three more times in reverse, sing god save the queen, then press the button and suceed 100% of the time. Easy. Edit: 0skill upgrades, such as ToW, DT, RDT use the 150skill numbers as its template. On paper the 150 metal skill crafter is perfectly fine for doing the +1 to +4/5 but I believe the 200 metal skill crafter is better for doing the +5 to +8, but that's just on paper and we all know the anvil chews up that table on the paper spits it out and says "you'll get what I decide to give you and be grateful" [/quote]

[quote="MERLIN"]Was about to paste that,you best me to it ;p[/quote]

[quote="LUPISCUS"]thats all in ''theory'' tho. Those odds do not seem to be reflected at all atm... its worse than that. Much worse[/quote]

[quote="RAVENSOUL"];) Only the last part of my previous post is from me the rest is flickthebean, and his wisdom still stands cause no matter if you use fails or not or sing or do a jig at the anvil when you press that produce button it's 50-50 the outcome only two possibilities win or lose ;)[/quote]

[quote="SAL3M"][quote="RAVENSOUL"]FlickTheBean 100skill 150skill 200skill +1 56% 67% 68% +2 52% 64% 66% +3 48% 61% 64% +4 44% 58% 62% +5 40% 55% 60% +6 36% 52% 58% +7 32% 49% 56% +8 28% 46% 54% Rolling Odds (+0~+X) Edit due to questions: (Think like an Accumulator bet) 100skill; +0~+1: 56% +0~+2: 29.12% +0~+3: 13.9776% +0~+4: 6.150144% +0~+5: 2.4600576% +0~+6: 0.885629736% +0~+7: 0.28340151552% +0~+8: 0.0793524243456% 150skill; +0~+1: 67% +0~+2: 42.88% +0~+3: 26.1568% +0~+4: 15.170944% +0~+5: 8.3440192% +0~+6: 4.338889984% +0~+7: 2.12605609216% +0~+8: 0.9779858023936% 200skill +0~+1: 68% +0~+2: 44.88% +0~+3: 28.7232% +0~+4: 17.808384% +0~+5: 10.6850304% +0~+6: 6.197317632% +0~+7: 3.47049787392% +0~+8: 1.8740688519168% So as you can see from the above information. Before you press upgrade, pray to jesus, satan and the wizard of oz, spin round three times, throw a bowl of salt over your shoulder, spin three more times in reverse, sing god save the queen, then press the button and suceed 100% of the time. Easy. Edit: 0skill upgrades, such as ToW, DT, RDT use the 150skill numbers as its template. On paper the 150 metal skill crafter is perfectly fine for doing the +1 to +4/5 but I believe the 200 metal skill crafter is better for doing the +5 to +8, but that's just on paper and we all know the anvil chews up that table on the paper spits it out and says "you'll get what I decide to give you and be grateful" [/quote] Do you have any idea whether he did this based on empirical evidence or whether he did it analytically based on the numbers that are supposedly true though? As Lupi correctly alluded to just now, if this isn't based on real experiment and the statistical analysis of real numbers then this may be totally divorce from reality just as you say the idea % goes up with skill was in esoma. Edit: Also not sure if you're joking but the idea that those numbers suggest it is 50-50 at the end of the day is totally incorrect. [/quote]