| Author | Content | Date |
|---|---|---|
|
WAGAWAGA |
Holly crap wois that guy, fist of all archer have the second lower deff in game, second of all archer dmg so weak except mages"cuz they running shit armours", idk who used befor but i can imagine u was pro biggner.
|
#31 2018/08/09 11:22:25 |
|
SAM0 |
"FRINGE"i was an archer myself when i played dsoma. and an axer and a spear. before patch came spear/knux were the best class to use. with new patch archers have the best of all worlds. near unhittable. do a decent amount of damage. have a decent amount of defence(which they barely need as they dont get hit). decent MD. Before balance patch axer was the best most OP class without a doubt. Archers do get hit (if I worked hit rates out correctly in other thread) other classes have had a big hate rate improvement over them aswell Somethings Wagas saying are true tho... People are saying if you want to damage a geared axer as an archer you have to use full attack+ set If you want to get more casts off and survive abit more as a mage vs archer then you have to run dex gear Why would it be fine to say archers need attack gear to deal damage to axers but not that mages need dex gear to survive/cast easier vs archers
PM
Reply
Quote
[quote="SAM0"][quote="FRINGE"]i was an archer myself when i played dsoma. and an axer and a spear. before patch came spear/knux were the best class to use. with new patch archers have the best of all worlds. near unhittable. do a decent amount of damage. have a decent amount of defence(which they barely need as they dont get hit). decent MD.
hopefully at cap + they look at the points distribution for other classes.[/quote]
Before balance patch axer was the best most OP class without a doubt.
Archers do get hit (if I worked hit rates out correctly in other thread) other classes have had a big hate rate improvement over them aswell
Somethings Wagas saying are true tho... People are saying if you want to damage a geared axer as an archer you have to use full attack+ set
If you want to get more casts off and survive abit more as a mage vs archer then you have to run dex gear
Why would it be fine to say archers need attack gear to deal damage to axers but not that mages need dex gear to survive/cast easier vs archers[/quote]
|
#32 2018/08/09 12:00:56 |
|
SLAYER |
"MERLIN"You're using a fast casting spell with lower damage to try get hits off, I'm guessing you've put a high dex set on your mage and removed your own df's and dex parts This 100%...if I could be bothered me and Merlin could go and make a video of the total opposite of what you have just shown... A mage shouldn't be able to just "survive" 1v1 anyway they should stand an equal chance of dropping you and run out of pots at a similar point in time to.
PM
Reply
Quote
[quote="SLAYER"][quote="MERLIN"]You're using a fast casting spell with lower damage to try get hits off, I'm guessing you've put a high dex set on your mage and removed your own df's and dex parts
It's easy to fudge anything in your favour when you aren't showing your gear [/quote]
This 100%...if I could be bothered me and Merlin could go and make a video of the total opposite of what you have just shown...
A mage shouldn't be able to just "survive" 1v1 anyway they should stand an equal chance of dropping you and run out of pots at a similar point in time to.[/quote]
|
#33 2018/08/09 12:11:26 |
|
KEKKET |
Wud all b fine if azazels had effect on cast speed, dont c why it shouldnt like all weaps go machinegun rate xept speed of mage stays same. Wasnt 2nd staff aura speed up bfor?
|
#34 2018/08/09 12:11:47 |
|
SAM0 |
"SLAYER""MERLIN"You're using a fast casting spell with lower damage to try get hits off, I'm guessing you've put a high dex set on your mage and removed your own df's and dex parts That's just like saying an archer should be able to damage/drop an axer 1v1... Doesn't happen. Mages have a much higher chance of dropping melle classes tho. It's just archers they struggle with Also games all gear based now, if mages are running amazing gear sets I'd guess they'd do alright overall (what they struggle with vs archer they'd make up against melle classes) Don't think I've seen a mage running a decent set for Pvp vs archers, all favouring 1 bomb proc sets. Even king of the mages Ibex has only +8 gear set total. Waga is running a +40 set
PM
Reply
Quote
[quote="SAM0"][quote="SLAYER"][quote="MERLIN"]You're using a fast casting spell with lower damage to try get hits off, I'm guessing you've put a high dex set on your mage and removed your own df's and dex parts
It's easy to fudge anything in your favour when you aren't showing your gear [/quote]
This 100%...if I could be bothered me and Merlin could go and make a video of the total opposite of what you have just shown...
A mage shouldn't be able to just "survive" 1v1 anyway they should stand an equal chance of dropping you and run out of pots at a similar point in time to.[/quote]
That's just like saying an archer should be able to damage/drop an axer 1v1... Doesn't happen.
Mages have a much higher chance of dropping melle classes tho. It's just archers they struggle with
Also games all gear based now, if mages are running amazing gear sets I'd guess they'd do alright overall (what they struggle with vs archer they'd make up against melle classes)
Don't think I've seen a mage running a decent set for Pvp vs archers, all favouring 1 bomb proc sets.
Even king of the mages Ibex has only +8 gear set total. Waga is running a +40 set[/quote]
|
#35 2018/08/09 12:31:26 |
|
SLAYER |
"KEKKET"Wud all b fine if azazels had effect on cast speed, dont c why it shouldnt like all weaps go machinegun rate xept speed of mage stays same. Wasnt 2nd staff aura speed up bfor? Another good point... |
#36 2018/08/09 12:48:57 |
|
DEIMOS |
mage caps with 164 dex, even in waga's +40 set if thats what he has, still leaves mages 9 dex behind archers, given everyone uses df/da theyre 19dex behind without any form dex on their other 2 access or any armour piece,
so they can get to +30 dex quite happily while keeping full +5pod set on all armour their damage output vs mage is almost the same while the mage now has maximum or 20%? per hit when it is allowed to cast which is still minimal. (while keeping a+ speed bow might i add) when hitting at a c? speed (dont no cast times) mage casting doing a max of 20% damage and no other damage auras archers should never drop below 80% health, you cant honestly say that would be more fair? we run procs because that is what we need to be worthwhile AT ALL, due to not being able to attack 90% of the time
PM
Reply
Quote
[quote="DEIMOS"]mage caps with 164 dex, even in waga's +40 set if thats what he has, still leaves mages 9 dex behind archers, given everyone uses df/da theyre 19dex behind without any form dex on their other 2 access or any armour piece,
so they can get to +30 dex quite happily while keeping full +5pod set on all armour
their damage output vs mage is almost the same while the mage now has maximum or 20%? per hit when it is allowed to cast which is still minimal. (while keeping a+ speed bow might i add)
when hitting at a c? speed (dont no cast times) mage casting doing a max of 20% damage and no other damage auras archers should never drop below 80% health, you cant honestly say that would be more fair? we run procs because that is what we need to be worthwhile AT ALL, due to not being able to attack 90% of the time[/quote]
|
#37 2018/08/09 12:54:13 |
|
DEIMOS |
and to quiet your comments of archers dont touch axers here is a vid from last night deimos vs kabuto - best tank gear i own (not all +5 etc but considering this is a nuk user in dex armour that more than cancels out and then some)
https://youtu.be/ylxRI2KPdqg
PM
Reply
Quote
[quote="DEIMOS"]and to quiet your comments of archers dont touch axers here is a vid from last night deimos vs kabuto - best tank gear i own (not all +5 etc but considering this is a nuk user in dex armour that more than cancels out and then some)
[url]https://youtu.be/ylxRI2KPdqg[/url]
[/quote]
|
#38 2018/08/09 12:58:34 |
|
SAM0 |
"DEIMOS"mage caps with 164 dex, even in waga's +40 set if thats what he has, still leaves mages 9 dex behind archers, given everyone uses df/da theyre 19dex behind without any form dex on their other 2 access or any armour piece, I said from the beginning mages struggle against archers only, all melle classes are at just as big if not bigger disadvantage against mages than mages are vs archers. You struggle against archers and melle classes struggle big time against you. It's balanced
PM
Reply
Quote
[quote="SAM0"][quote="DEIMOS"]mage caps with 164 dex, even in waga's +40 set if thats what he has, still leaves mages 9 dex behind archers, given everyone uses df/da theyre 19dex behind without any form dex on their other 2 access or any armour piece,
so they can get to +30 dex quite happily while keeping full +5pod set on all armour
their damage output vs mage is almost the same while the mage now has maximum or 20%? per hit when it is allowed to cast which is still minimal. (while keeping a+ speed bow might i add)
when hitting at a c? speed (dont no cast times) mage casting doing a max of 20% damage and no other damage auras archers should never drop below 80% health, you cant honestly say that would be more fair? we run procs because that is what we need to be worthwhile AT ALL, due to not being able to attack 90% of the time[/quote]
I said from the beginning mages struggle against archers only, all melle classes are at just as big if not bigger disadvantage against mages than mages are vs archers.
You struggle against archers and melle classes struggle big time against you. It's balanced [/quote]
|
#39 2018/08/09 13:02:16 |
|
SAM0 |
"DEIMOS"and to quiet your comments of archers dont touch axers here is a vid from last night deimos vs kabuto - best tank gear i own (not all +5 etc but considering this is a nuk user in dex armour that more than cancels out and then some) Your gear must be very poor as I tested in equal gear axer vs archer and it took the archer 20 arrows to kill the axer and the axer 11-35 swings to kill the archer. When it comes to Pvp and your taking such low damage and can carry 400 pots I know what I'd rather Will make and upload videos later showing both sides gear I've also hit kekket while in full dex gear on my knux and it isn't even close to minimum damage it IS minimum damage
PM
Reply
Quote
[quote="SAM0"][quote="DEIMOS"]and to quiet your comments of archers dont touch axers here is a vid from last night deimos vs kabuto - best tank gear i own (not all +5 etc but considering this is a nuk user in dex armour that more than cancels out and then some)
[url]https://youtu.be/ylxRI2KPdqg[/url]
[/quote]
Your gear must be very poor as I tested in equal gear axer vs archer and it took the archer 20 arrows to kill the axer and the axer 11-35 swings to kill the archer.
When it comes to Pvp and your taking such low damage and can carry 400 pots I know what I'd rather
Will make and upload videos later showing both sides gear
I've also hit kekket while in full dex gear on my knux and it isn't even close to minimum damage it IS minimum damage[/quote]
|
#40 2018/08/09 13:04:55 |
|
WAGAWAGA |
I can do the same with axer vs kabuto and show u how he gona miss and dont be choked if i killed.
|
#41 2018/08/09 13:06:00 |
|
SLAYER |
"SAM0""SLAYER""MERLIN"You're using a fast casting spell with lower damage to try get hits off, I'm guessing you've put a high dex set on your mage and removed your own df's and dex parts Did you not read what I said? should take note of the words I use... With an axer vs archer the axer will run out of pots first (or similar rate if stood toe to toe not hit and running) and neither will drop, so it meets what I said. I said "should be able to stand an equal chance..." (in your example of axe vs archer it's nil chance of death on either side) so fulfills my argument of dropping their opponent and running out of pots at a similar point/rate. First point can be met vs some classes, but in reality due to range and ability to switch from dex to pod gear most classes can't pvp vs an archer. Versus a mage especially they are fucked, 1v1 it's just pointless for them unless the mage is going for a surprise attack and gets extremely lucky. You kinda back up the point we are making here btw...saying they struggle with archers (I know you have already said this isn't a bad idea but I'm just highlighting things)...that's the whole point...need to come up with a solution where they aren't so fucked by the main class on the server. An archer can beef up their ability to fuck up any other class in two directions, what can a mage do in reality? they can build MA or Proc (MA set pretty pointless other than for hunting) obviously, but if they used a CT set to survive a bit better they won't be able to do all the things you say they have to their advantage (i.e. one bomb), pre casting wouldn't be doing shit, won't be able to weaken etc etc. Making 4th invisible, longer duration etc would help most for the mage vs archers over other classes as well. Keks point on AZ is a good one to, why can't you make a spell cast significantly (That is in bold) faster like we now can with weapons, we have all had our attack speed beefed up massively...whilst a mage? (baring in mind their spells are interrupt able obviously).... Hsoma has different ways for a mage to survive i.e. a dex mage, with dodge and m tag weapons...mages on dsoma need something desperately and if people can't see that, come back at me with a point and let's discuss.
PM
Reply
Quote
[quote="SLAYER"][quote="SAM0"][quote="SLAYER"][quote="MERLIN"]You're using a fast casting spell with lower damage to try get hits off, I'm guessing you've put a high dex set on your mage and removed your own df's and dex parts
It's easy to fudge anything in your favour when you aren't showing your gear [/quote]
This 100%...if I could be bothered me and Merlin could go and make a video of the total opposite of what you have just shown...
A mage shouldn't be able to just "survive" 1v1 anyway they should stand an equal chance of dropping you and run out of pots at a similar point in time to.[/quote]
That's just like saying an archer should be able to damage/drop an axer 1v1... Doesn't happen.
Mages have a much higher chance of dropping melle classes tho. It's just archers they struggle with
Also games all gear based now, if mages are running amazing gear sets I'd guess they'd do alright overall (what they struggle with vs archer they'd make up against melle classes)
Don't think I've seen a mage running a decent set for Pvp vs archers, all favouring 1 bomb proc sets.
Even king of the mages Ibex has only +8 gear set total. Waga is running a +40 set[/quote]
Did you not read what I said? should take note of the words I use...
With an axer vs archer the axer will run out of pots first (or similar rate if stood toe to toe not hit and running) and neither will drop, so it meets what I said.
I said "should be able to stand an equal chance..." (in your example of axe vs archer it's nil chance of death on either side) so fulfills my argument of dropping their opponent and running out of pots at a similar point/rate.
First point can be met vs some classes, but in reality due to range and ability to switch from dex to pod gear most classes can't pvp vs an archer. Versus a mage especially they are fucked, 1v1 it's just pointless for them unless the mage is going for a surprise attack and gets extremely lucky.
You kinda back up the point we are making here btw...saying they struggle with archers (I know you have already said this isn't a bad idea but I'm just highlighting things)...that's the whole point...need to come up with a solution where they aren't so fucked by the main class on the server.
An archer can beef up their ability to fuck up any other class in two directions, what can a mage do in reality? they can build MA or Proc (MA set pretty pointless other than for hunting) obviously, but if they used a CT set to survive a bit better they won't be able to do all the things you say they have to their advantage (i.e. one bomb), pre casting wouldn't be doing shit, won't be able to weaken etc etc.
Making 4th invisible, longer duration etc would help most for the mage vs archers over other classes as well.
Keks point on AZ is a good one to, why can't you make a spell cast [b]significantly[/b] (That is in bold) faster like we now can with weapons, we have all had our attack speed beefed up massively...whilst a mage? (baring in mind their spells are interrupt able obviously)....
Hsoma has different ways for a mage to survive i.e. a dex mage, with dodge and m tag weapons...mages on dsoma need something desperately and if people can't see that, come back at me with a point and let's discuss.
[/quote]
|
#42 2018/08/09 13:09:49 |
|
SAM0 |
"SLAYER""SAM0""SLAYER""MERLIN"You're using a fast casting spell with lower damage to try get hits off, I'm guessing you've put a high dex set on your mage and removed your own df's and dex parts I did agree mages struggle vs archers. All the melle classes struggle with mages just as hard, a mage can run the 1 bomb set and kill melle classes before they even get in range... So they struggle with one class but are fine against 4 classes.... Mages could also build dex builds on dsoma, just like Hsoma they'd have more survivability but lose the chance to one shot people, just like on Hsoma. Yes archer won't kill an axer 1v1 neither will an axer kill archer. But the PvP isn't based around 1v1 and when axers are taking huge chunks of HP off an archer when they hit but archers are doing small damage in return. I know which one is most likely to kill someone. Dsoma mages still have the evasion aura no? What's stopping them running full dex gear+evasion aura just like Hsoma Have you ever seen what happens when a very geared Hsoma mage like papapilas is fighting a geared archer in Hsoma? He can't cast, and if there is 2 archers he can't even outpot it. This is no different to DSoma mages +Hsoma doesn't have 4th aura
PM
Reply
Quote
[quote="SAM0"][quote="SLAYER"][quote="SAM0"][quote="SLAYER"][quote="MERLIN"]You're using a fast casting spell with lower damage to try get hits off, I'm guessing you've put a high dex set on your mage and removed your own df's and dex parts
It's easy to fudge anything in your favour when you aren't showing your gear [/quote]
This 100%...if I could be bothered me and Merlin could go and make a video of the total opposite of what you have just shown...
A mage shouldn't be able to just "survive" 1v1 anyway they should stand an equal chance of dropping you and run out of pots at a similar point in time to.[/quote]
That's just like saying an archer should be able to damage/drop an axer 1v1... Doesn't happen.
Mages have a much higher chance of dropping melle classes tho. It's just archers they struggle with
Also games all gear based now, if mages are running amazing gear sets I'd guess they'd do alright overall (what they struggle with vs archer they'd make up against melle classes)
Don't think I've seen a mage running a decent set for Pvp vs archers, all favouring 1 bomb proc sets.
Even king of the mages Ibex has only +8 gear set total. Waga is running a +40 set[/quote]
Did you not read what I said? should take note of the words I use...
With an axer vs archer the axer will run out of pots first (or similar rate if stood toe to toe not hit and running) and neither will drop, so it meets what I said.
I said "should be able to stand an equal chance..." (in your example of axe vs archer it's nil chance of death on either side) so fulfills my argument of dropping their opponent and running out of pots at a similar point/rate.
First point can be met vs some classes, but in reality due to range and ability to switch from dex to pod gear most classes can't pvp vs an archer. Versus a mage especially they are fucked, 1v1 it's just pointless for them unless the mage is going for a surprise attack and gets extremely lucky.
You kinda back up the point we are making here btw...saying they struggle with archers (I know you have already said this isn't a bad idea but I'm just highlighting things)...that's the whole point...need to come up with a solution where they aren't so fucked by the main class on the server.
An archer can beef up their ability to fuck up any other class in two directions, what can a mage do in reality? they can build MA or Proc (MA set pretty pointless other than for hunting) obviously, but if they used a CT set to survive a bit better they won't be able to do all the things you say they have to their advantage (i.e. one bomb), pre casting wouldn't be doing shit, won't be able to weaken etc etc.
Making 4th invisible, longer duration etc would help most for the mage vs archers over other classes as well.
Keks point on AZ is a good one to, why can't you make a spell cast [b]significantly[/b] (That is in bold) faster like we now can with weapons, we have all had our attack speed beefed up massively...whilst a mage? (baring in mind their spells are interrupt able obviously)....
Hsoma has different ways for a mage to survive i.e. a dex mage, with dodge and m tag weapons...mages on dsoma need something desperately and if people can't see that, come back at me with a point and let's discuss.
[/quote]
I did agree mages struggle vs archers. All the melle classes struggle with mages just as hard, a mage can run the 1 bomb set and kill melle classes before they even get in range...
So they struggle with one class but are fine against 4 classes....
Mages could also build dex builds on dsoma, just like Hsoma they'd have more survivability but lose the chance to one shot people, just like on Hsoma.
Yes archer won't kill an axer 1v1 neither will an axer kill archer. But the PvP isn't based around 1v1 and when axers are taking huge chunks of HP off an archer when they hit but archers are doing small damage in return. I know which one is most likely to kill someone.
Dsoma mages still have the evasion aura no? What's stopping them running full dex gear+evasion aura just like Hsoma
Have you ever seen what happens when a very geared Hsoma mage like papapilas is fighting a geared archer in Hsoma?
He can't cast, and if there is 2 archers he can't even outpot it. This is no different to DSoma mages
+Hsoma doesn't have 4th aura[/quote]
|
#43 2018/08/09 13:14:41 |
|
DEIMOS |
Axe is never most likely to kill anyone, they have no attack aura to drop damage when they please or when they see the other player low hp, it's very predictable damage and easily outpotted
|
#44 2018/08/09 13:18:41 |
|
DEIMOS |
Yes they do but you're giving them a 'bit'of survivability while still not being able to attack the majority of the time and when they did its a flat 230ma+staff that is it, no proc no weaken aa yiu get a 5 seconds warning while it being cast then another 5 seconds before the attack cast drops, if that isnt potted they dont deserve to survive anyone but even then it would still take the mage 3-4 hits to kill
PM
Reply
Quote
[quote="DEIMOS"]Yes they do but you're giving them a 'bit'of survivability while still not being able to attack the majority of the time and when they did its a flat 230ma+staff that is it, no proc no weaken aa yiu get a 5 seconds warning while it being cast then another 5 seconds before the attack cast drops, if that isnt potted they dont deserve to survive anyone but even then it would still take the mage 3-4 hits to kill[/quote]
|
#45 2018/08/09 13:21:11 |
Please sign in with one of your characters to reply